Thursday, August 20, 2009

Public Caning

What do you make of this?

A model who will be caned six times in Malaysia next week for drinking beer appealed Thursday for her punishment to be carried out in public to deter other Muslims.

Kartika Sari Dewi Shukarno, 32, was also fined 5,000 ringgit (1,400 dollars) last month after she pleaded guilty to drinking alcohol at a hotel nightclub in the eastern state of Pahang last year.

She will be the first woman in the multicultural country to be caned under Islamic law, with the punishment set to be meted out in a female prison.

But the Malaysian mother of two, who lives in neighbouring Singapore, said Thursday that she wanted to be caned publicly.

"It will be a more effective way to educate Muslims not to drink if I am caned in public. I want to send this message to other Muslims and I am sincere," Kartika told AFP.

"I am willing to be caned publicly or in front of a mosque, but the prosecutor has told my dad today that this cannot be done. I also requested for journalists to witness the caning in prison but it is not allowed."

Kartika, who has lived in Singapore for 15 years after marrying a citizen of the city-state, said she had the support of her parents and husband to be publicly punished.

She denies using her sentencing as a way to boost her part-time modelling career.

"I am not thinking about popularity or modelling, I am only thinking about my religion and want to tell Muslims to stay away from alcohol," she said.


From Hermione's Heart

11 comments:

Karl Friedrich Gauss said...

Could it be she's a kinky exhibitionist at heart?

Serenity Everton said...

In public, they can't be extra severe. Or give her more than the judge said. Or do anything else inappropriate.

It seems to me that there are a lot of risks with doing it privately, although publicly is certainly more humiliating.

I'd be interested to know if anyone is allowed to observe - anyone chosen by the victim that is, and I use the word 'victim' intentionally. Mostly because this is a point of Islamic law that I find paradoxical. Since all women are supposed to be subject to a guardian's supervision, shouldn't her father be in charge of deciding whether she should be punished or not, and how?

s

Karl Friedrich Gauss said...

Serenity, you may be right about all that.

One problem with a public caning might be the modesty issue, although I'm not sure exactly what clothing is allowed in Singaporean judicial canings.

Amazing that we seem to have commented at the same time! Jinx, jinx, double jinx!

sixofthebest said...

I wish that all women who drink in excess of their capabilities should be treated to a public caning. Up with their dress or skirt, down with their knickers, or panties, and a good dose of the cane, birch, or whip, should be applied vigoriously to their bare bottoms. Would'nt you all agree on my sentiments

Anonymous said...

This kind of law makes me sick. I tolerate every kind of religion, but I feel nausea when I hear of people suffering like that. I´m into spanking, but this is nothing I can bare. Spanking for fun or punishment in private= yes, caning for judical reasons= no!

Angie said...

Here is something that I found-the short recap is that in Malaysia Judicial canings are NOT the same as Islamic Sharia canings.

here you go:
MALAYSIA: Judicial CP

Severe corporal punishment by order of the courts, for males only (and confined until recently to those aged under 50), is routine for many serious offences, notably those involving sex, violence or drugs. This is always combined with a prison sentence (at any rate in adult cases), and takes the form of a specified number of powerful strokes with a big rattan cane, or rotan, across the offender's bare seat.

The punishment is delivered inside prison by specially trained prison officers. It is never administered in public. To the modern western eye it is a rather brutal affair: where more than a few strokes are involved (the maximum, though relatively rare, is 24), blood is drawn. See these pictures and, if you can bear it, these video clips.

In these and other respects the procedure largely resembles that in Singapore, though the modus operandi differs in detail. It is a development of what was inherited from British colonial days, and has nothing to do with Islamic law.

In a milder version (often a token single stroke of the cane), CP is also an almost invariable part of the sentence on the thousands of illegal immigrants who arrive every year, mostly from Indonesia.

MAIN ARTICLE: See comprehensive feature article Judicial caning in Singapore, Malaysia and Brunei (illustrated) for full details of history and modus operandi, first-person and eyewitness accounts, links to press articles, and an overview of the legislative situation.


In addition to these canings under the criminal law, there are occasional reports of mild caning sentences being ordered by the separate religious courts (for Muslims only) under Shariah law for things like alcohol consumption. These are much less severe, and intended to be more or less a token gesture. Even so, when reported in the newspapers they have produced an outcry, as in this June 2005 case.

In January 2009 it was confirmed that these Shariah "light canings" may also be applied to women, another stark difference from the usual judicial canings. However, they are evidently highly controversial and might never actually be carried out: as at January 2009 the aforementioned June 2005 sentences had still not been implemented.

Check out the link for 2005 articles about sharia canings.

It appears that men and women would both get a max of 6 strokes, and the women get theirs while seated. Nothing was mentioned as to dress or undress for the sharia canings.


Angie

cookie said...

...."It appears that men and women would both get a max of 6 strokes, and the women get theirs while seated"
Okay I have to question this one as how in the world are you going to cane someone that is seated. Where excatly are these 6 strokes going then. I mean when I think of being seated then I am sitting on my bottom.
And I would much rather be caned bent over then in a seating position. Too much room for error there and accidental hitting of my back or elsewhere. OUCH.
Although I personally do believe in discipline spankings and canings but only in the context of being carried out with love and caring. Although I could see it as a judical thing but only if the person had someone to take care of her afterwards. I really don't know. I do believe if the threat of CP was made some people might be less inclined to do certain things. I dont know.

Fabsterrant said...

Wikipedia has all the following as part of a series on corporal punishment. Thanks to Angie and her hard work its clear that the law of the land can be very severe. But(pun fun intended) I think she said it for her career and needs attention and would be a bigger star if she asked for some of these at wikipedia:
Belting · Birching · Caning
Cat o' nine tails · Flagellation
Foot whipping · Knout · Paddle
Slippering · Spanking · Strapping
Switch · Tawse
In regards to really severe punishment I can imagine the guard with the cane inside the prison shouting "I wish this was a sword!"
as he administered the strokes.
As far as Cookies's observation goes about being seated I think the cane might actually go across the shoulders.
Thank goodness Bill Clinton got those two girl out of 12 years of hard labor and just a few days later a couple were held in Pakistani tribal areas.
"Thank you for your service" to all those that serve to make the world a better place and please consider posting at "Tits for the Troops" lol.
http://titsfortroops.net/
Actually that could help her career also. Ty for seeing the lighter side.

Sincerely, fab

ronnie said...

Very interesting post Hermione and thanks to Angie for the information she found.

You know we have some idiots her in the UK who agree with this law and Somebody told me that the Archbishop of Canterbury is calling for Sharia law to operate here in the UK

It is only Muslims in Malaysia that can be flogged for drinking alcohol. How do they know a women in a Muslim and not a Christian?

Thanks Hermione.

Ronnie
xx

Hermione said...

I thought the fact that she wanted a public caning was very odd, and quite possibly connected to the fact that she is a model (is that allowed in Muslim countries?) and was looking for publicity. And the modesty issue is also interesting. I suspect clothing would be worn.

The issue of customs and practices being transported along with immigrants to their new countries of residence - like Britain or Canada - is also problematic. We don't condone the sort of thing that is commonplace and accepted elsewhere. Honour killings come to mind as well as canings.

Thank you all for your remarks on this news item.

Hugs,
Hermione

sixofthebest said...

Be it ancient times, or modern times, there should be a whipping post in every town square around the world. Where naughty women would be fastened to. Then their skirts raised, their bloomers, taken down, and with birch, cane or whip lashed on their bare bottoms.